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Q&A - to be sorted

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1 Re: Q&A - to be sorted on Wed Jul 01, 2009 7:41 am

Anonymous 07 April 2009 21:10

Salam Ya Ustaadh,

My teacher at university said that both of the methods of turning a sentence in to future tense can be used, for example you can say "I will do it in a minute" which is close future using "sawfa" and she said it makes sense.

I'm confused, as both my teachers are saying two different things!

please help,

Shukran
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Arabic Lessons 08 April 2009 00:11

وعليكم السلام

As mentioned in the class the سَـ is used for the closer future and the سَـوْفَ is more distant than سَـ.

This is a WELL KNOWN FACT and anyone who disputes the above is WEAK in their understanding.

Thus, the question lies in what we DEFINE as "close" and "distant" future.

In terms of your example, then you can say this and it WILL NOT be wrong. However, it could mean that you have a lot of chores to do beforehand and thus for you, this time (a minute) is lengthy.

So, they both make sense, yes, but they have differences in meaning in terms of nuance.

I hope that clarifies your understanding.

ابـــن منظـــور
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Nurjahan 08 April 2009 14:33

Assalamualaikum wa Rahmatullah,

I have a few questions regarding lesson three:

1. I have noticed a few inconsistencies in spelling of the word preposition in Arabic, so please clarify what is the correct spelling;
حُرُوُفُ جَرٌ (1
حَرْفُجرٌ (2
حَرْفُ الْجرُ (3

or does the spelling vary according to context?

2. I am slightly confused as to the spelling of the same word in different tenses. As I understand it, the same word can have a varying second radical in different tenses? For instance; in دَخَلَ the second radical is فتحة and in يَدْخُلُ the second radical is ضمة and in سَيَدْخُلُ the second radical is once again ضمة. My question being can the second radical vary within the same word being portrayed in varying tenses? So potentially the second radical in the future tense can vary from the second radical in the past and present tense?

3. In the sentence بَـعَـثَ اللَـهُ رُسُـلاً إِلَى الْـعَـالَـمِ the object, so is منصوبٌ indicated by فتحة my question is why does رُسُـلاً have fat’hatein on the last letter and not just فتحة?

I think this is all for now.

wasalaam
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Arabic Lessons 08 April 2009 16:27

وعليكم السلام

First question

Please find the meaning of the three questions posed. We will study the construction of these words in the next lesson. They come under the umbrella of "posession".

حُرُوُفُ جَرٍّ (1
حَرْفُ جرٍّ (2
حَرْفُ الْجرِّ (3

1) prepositions (indefinite)
2) preposition (indefinite)
3) the preposition (definite)

Second question

As you are aware, the 2nd radical can take any of the vowels in the past tense and the present tense. Therefore, these need to be memorised off by heart. They can end up being the same vowel or maybe not.

The 2nd radical in the future tense is EXACTLY THE SAME as the 2nd radical in the present tense. This is due to the fact that we simply add any of the two future particle indicators to our present tense verb to make it into a future tense verb.

Third question

It has a تنوين as the word is indefinite. Should I have wanted to translate "the messengers", I would have place الـ and have only one فتحة.

I hope the responses above are clear.

As a side point, "fat’hatein" is slightly incorrect. It should have been فـتـحـتـان . We will cover this in coming lessons iA.

ابـــن منظـــور
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Nurjahan 08 April 2009 16:32

Asalaumaiakum,

One last question, for the homework set, if students wanted to write out the work what would be more preferable, to hand write using Nask script or Ruq'ah? And which would be more beneficial for the student?

Shukran
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Arabic Lessons 08 April 2009 16:40

Please use the script that mimicks closest the text to "Standard Arabic" as in the default Arabic script of a computer software.

This will help facilitate easier reading of homework.

Nurjahan 08 April 2009 16:41
I have another question,

In the class you mentioned that هل or أ are used to convert a sentence into a question. I find this hard to understand, for instance the following three sentence to questions;

1. He read a book = Did he read a book?
2. The teacher is standing = Is the teacher standing?
3. He was hurt = Was he hurt?

so in these cases هل and أ encompass 'is' 'did' and 'was?'

Or is the case that there are other terms specified to ask a question and then هل and أ are used to convert the rest of the sentences to questions?

I hope my question makes sense

wasalam
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Arabic Lessons 08 April 2009 16:45

The two interrogative particles as you mentioned turn a sentence into a question.

Therefore, for all your examples (written below), the simple addition of هل or أ would give you the desired interrogative sentence.

1. He read a book = Did he read a book?
2. The teacher is standing = Is the teacher standing?
3. He was hurt = Was he hurt?

ابــن منظــور
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Anonymous 08 April 2009 23:09

Assalaamu Alaikum wa rahmatullah

Ya Ayyuhal Ustaadhu,

The prepositional complement (إسمٌ مخرورٌ) is now clear to me however, I wish to ask to ask two further questions regarding prepositions inshAllah:

Firstly, it is understood that there are single word prepositions such as على , إلى , مِنْ however, what if we consider those prepositions that include صفةٌ (adj.) or a ظرفٌ (adv.) as a complement, for example, 'by far', 'at last', 'until now', 'since when' etc, how would this type of preposition be constructed or phrased?

Secondly, in English some prepositions end up side by side in the same sentence, for example,

1) '..out(from)(under) the table..'
2) '..everywhere (except)(in) the kitchen..'

Is it possible to do this in Arabic? Can we say for example, 'خرخَ مِنْ تحْتَ الطاولةِ'?

My next questions are:

The nominal sentence الولدُ جالسٌ في البيتِ tells us that 'the boy is sitting in the house', however, does this sentence mean the same thing as the sentence,
'الولدُ يجلسُ في البيتِ' ?

Ya Ustaadhu, I have noticed whilst reading other material that some words do not have double dhamma when in the nominitive state, for example, مصرُ (Egypt), دمشقُ (Damascus), (garden) حدائقُ , etc. In this case, do the genetive and accusative marker changes still apply? Do they change to fatha and kasra, and are they double or single indicators (حركاتٌ) ?

Last but not least, a side point about the balaaghah comment about the use of سوفَ instead of س to elongate the time that passes between those that wished to meet again soon, I had an inclination that perhaps if the same two individuals i.e. husband and wife, used the word سوفَ continuously, but perhaps one spouse was upset on one particular day and used the س instead this time, then this would mean that those ten hours were not long enough! Is this interpretation credible? It is very interesting to analyse the possible meaning outcomes, subhaanAllah.

JazaakAllahu khairal jazaa'i

طالبةُ ابن منظور
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Arabic Lessons 09 April 2009 01:19

وعليكم السلام ورحمة الله

The first point I would like to make is that اسم مجرور is spelt with a ا and not an أ.

In regards to your first question, then we have not covered these in our lessons yet. Therefore, I will not answer this question now.

Your second question is similar to your first question. I will not attend to it here but please remember not to translate everything "word for word". Bear in mind that sometimes the structure gives rise to meaning. For example, the word "is" is implied in the structure.

Your third question is a good one. They indeed carry the same meaning. The only difference is that the sentence with the verb يجلسُ means that he is sitting now. The former sentence with جالسٌ is a noun. Therefore it does not have the "time" factor attached to it.

The next question is one that we have not studied yet. Again, this will be left until we encounter it in our lesson.

Your final analysis is completely fine. Rhetoric cannot "really" be wrong. It is just what you are trying to say. Please note that it would be pointless to speak in rhetoric to those that do not understand as that would defeat the purpose.

As a final note, please only pose questions about the lessons studied. You will only confuse yourself (and maybe others) if you ask questions about subjects not yet taught.

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2 Re: Q&A - to be sorted on Wed Jul 01, 2009 7:42 am

Ambia 09 April 2009 09:44

Assalamualaikum,

I am slightly confused with the adding of an Alif in the object of a verbal sentence. Is the Alif applied to objects which end in tanween with the exception of the ة & ء

Hope I am making sense iA.

Jazaakallah Khairan
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Arabic Lessons 09 April 2009 14:19

وعليكم السلام

The addition of such an ا occurs IF AND ONLY IF the word that the ا is being added to has a تنوين الفتح . However, ء and ة are esempt from this rule.

ابــن منظــور
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Ambia 09 April 2009 14:20

Assalamulaikum,

I have a question in relation to the verbal sentence.

Can an object in the verbal sentence be preceded by a preposition? If so what case does it take? I was under the assumption that an object in the verbal sentence is always منصوب

Please clarify.

Jazakallah Khairan
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Arabic Lessons 09 April 2009 14:23

وعليكم السلام

We spoke about objects being in the accusative case when it is a DIRECT OBJECT.

In the case of a preposition, we ALWAYS have to render the word following it in a genetive case.

I hope that the response is clear.

ابــن منظــور
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Z 10 April 2009 16:53

Assalam alaikum,

This is not strictly relevant to the lessons we covered however it it can be of benefit to whole inshaAllah.

In regards to configurational properties of nouns, Linguists say that case is inflected on nouns as case-markings/forms and word order. In English case is expressed through word order, i.e in "John saw Mary" and "Mary saw John" the first noun is the subject in nominativity and the direct object if the noun following the verb in accusativity. Therefore the meanings in "John saw Mary" and "Mary saw John" are 100% different.

In Latin nouns have case forms as the word order is freer, meaning that the subject (NOM) and object (ACC) can switch positions in a sentence and the meaning is not changed. My question here is that can this too be the case for Arabic?

"al waladu ya'kulun kaboban"

..can this sentence hold the same meaning if written lke this...

"kaboban ya'kulun al waladu"

This thought came upon me as I was indulgent in my Linguistic revision!

Ma'asalama
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Arabic Lessons 10 April 2009 21:32

وعليكم السلام

I am not sure what your Arabic sentence is trying to say. However, your question is clear and please find your response below.

In Arabic word order DOES NOT matter. The meaning is given by CASE. Therefore, it is incumbent that all vowels are voiced as they are the indicators of CASE as studied.

Thus, the following sentences have the SAME meaning;

ضَـرَبَ مَـحَـمَّـدٌ حَـامِـداً

ضَـرَبَ حَـامِـداً مَـحَـمَّـدٌ

Muhammad beat up Khalid.

I hope that attends to your query.

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Anonymous 10 April 2009 22:57

Assalaamu alaikum

Just a qick question ya Ustaadh, why have you used 'mabniyyun 'alal fathi' and not the word 'fathatun' that you taught us, i.e. 'alal fathati'? Does 'fathi' mean something different?

Shukran jazeelan
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Arabic Lessons 11 April 2009 00:06

وعليكم السلام

When using فتح I am speaking in general terms. It is the class of فتحة that I am referring to and not a specific فتحة.

Please say مبني على الفتح when using مبني.

مع السلامة

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